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Home » Messageboard » When the laws of physics pack up » Message 3346313

[challenge entry] Schrodinger discovers the truth

From the When the laws of physics pack up challenge. See all 348 entries (closed)

(staggs28, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:32, archived)
# 4 !
(I helped save b3ta! chobb ,ø¤ºGREATº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRAPISTº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRECOMMENDEDº¤ø, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:33, archived)
# Pardon my ingnorance
but can someone explain this whole Schrodiger's Cat thing to me?
(I helped save b3ta! MakTheYak, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:35, archived)
# sure
its just your basic wave particle duality stuff. Nothing to really write home about.
(staggs28, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:36, archived)
# or
infact something different to wave-particle
duality; like, eg., entangled states.
(haberman is singing in the changes, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:37, archived)
# basicly
he said that to observe something effects how that object behaves ...so by the act of observing that object it not longer does what you wanted to observe as its been effected by the observation..
(I helped save b3ta! Tyronne Get To Falkirk, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:37, archived)
# Ta
very informative!
(I helped save b3ta! MakTheYak, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:44, archived)
# It's a famous thought experiment.
You have a cat in a box. Along with the cat there is a vial of poison, and a radioactive source. There is a certain probability that the radioactive source will emit a particle that shatters the vial, releasing the poison and killing the cat.

While the lid is on the box, you have no way of knowing if this has occured. Therefore the cat is in a state of "Quantum Flux" and is neither alive, nor dead, but some undetermined state.

When you open the box and determine wether the cat is alive it then "becomes" one or the other.

It's a demonstration of observer-specific reality in quantum physics.

Or something...
(I helped save b3ta! supermoore: HUNG, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:39, archived)
# I've never understood this one.
Surely the cat is either alive or dead. Looking in the box only informs the viewer as to its state.
(I helped save b3ta! chobb ,ø¤ºGREATº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRAPISTº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRECOMMENDEDº¤ø, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:41, archived)
# the
effect of the observation effects the outcome kinda thing.
(I helped save b3ta! Tyronne Get To Falkirk, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:42, archived)
# Yes, but
that's not much good to the observer is it? Until you view it it could be a dancing monkey for all you know.
(I helped save b3ta! supermoore: HUNG, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:43, archived)
# a
dancing monkey in a box is more fun mind.
(I helped save b3ta! Tyronne Get To Falkirk, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:44, archived)
# The observer is ignorant of the state of the cat,
but the cat *is* either alive or dead.

(I helped save b3ta! chobb ,ø¤ºGREATº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRAPISTº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRECOMMENDEDº¤ø, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:45, archived)
# And you know this how?
Our scientific method is based on observation. How can you establish a fact if you can't back it up with experimental observation?

It's a philisophical issue, granted, but there you go.
(I helped save b3ta! supermoore: HUNG, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:48, archived)
# I know this because the cat can *only* be alive or dead.
It cannot be in a 'state of flux', because cats don't do that.
(I helped save b3ta! chobb ,ø¤ºGREATº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRAPISTº¤ø,¸¸,ø¤ºRECOMMENDEDº¤ø, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:52, archived)
# How do you know that unless you have observed it to be true?
Since the only time the cat can be in flux is when it is not being observed, it is impossible to say.
(I helped save b3ta! supermoore: HUNG, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:53, archived)
# woo
ah yes, the demonstration of the absurdities of traditional logic as compared to quantum states where-in people feel compelled to supply seemingly obvious contradictions entirely based on alternative methods of measuring the results while the reality lay in the fact that the methods all constitute measurement of the concealed state..
excellent exercise in thinking "outside the box" and introduction into the realities of the breakdown between more a more newtonian view of physics and the reality of quantum mechanics. a quintessential zen approach to expansion of knowledge through unanswerable questions.

more or less, i have no idea what im talking about, but it sounds friggin great, eh?
(incipient, Sun 20 Jun 2004, 11:37, archived)
# Who needs to look in the box when you can just shake it and see if it meows?
(I helped save b3ta! MakTheYak, Fri 18 Jun 2004, 13:45, archived)